Could the unidentified baby be Black Organization boss Renya Karasuma?
And could the elderly woman pushing the stroller be Vermouth in disguise?
In Volume 106, an unidentified baby and an elderly woman appear near the kidnapping of Conan and Azusa Enomoto. They are neither culprit nor victim, yet the pair is shown twice in the same case.
That unusual presentation has fueled theories connecting them to Renya Karasuma. This article reviews their appearances, the evidence for and against the theory, the Vermouth hypothesis, and what the manga and anime actually establish.
The Unidentified Baby’s Identity Is Still Unknown: The Renya Karasuma Theory in Brief
The identity of the baby whose face is concealed remains unclear and has not been revealed.
There are reasons the Renya Karasuma theory attracts attention, but confirmed information must remain separate from an interpretation that links several clues.
- The baby’s name, sex, and age are unknown.
- Any connection to the Black Organization is unconfirmed.
- Renya Karasuma is confirmed as the Black Organization’s boss.
- Karasuma’s present appearance and location are unknown.
- The idea that the baby is Karasuma remains a theory.
- The idea that the elderly woman is Vermouth is also unconfirmed.
A hidden face, an unseen boss, and the later comparison between a cat’s cry and a baby’s cry make an evocative set of clues. Even so, the story may be pointing toward an answer without having disclosed that answer.
The Only Confirmed Fact Is That the Baby Remains Unidentified
What the story confirms is that the baby was riding in a stroller pushed by an elderly woman. The face and hair are not shown, and nobody calls the baby by name.
There is no cry or spoken line that establishes age or sex. The baby’s relationship to the woman is also unknown: they could be grandmother and grandchild, a disguised caretaker and ward, or something else entirely.
No member of the Black Organization is shown recognizing or reacting to the baby. On confirmed information alone, the description must stop at an unidentified baby whose appearance is withheld.
Still, deliberately hiding the baby’s face is conspicuous. That direction strongly suggests the baby may matter later, although it does not establish who the baby is.
The Renya Karasuma Theory Is Compelling but Unconfirmed
The baby-as-Karasuma theory fits naturally with the series’ central premise of physical de-aging. Shinichi Kudo and Shiho Miyano became physically younger after taking APTX 4869.
It is therefore possible to wonder whether the Black Organization’s long-running drug research also affected its boss. Karasuma’s name has been revealed, but his present body has never been shown clearly.
Volume 106 introduces the faceless baby. Volume 107 then uses a cat whose cry sounds like a baby’s to recall Suguru Itakura’s diary, making the earlier phone-call clue newly relevant.
However, the baby is never shown taking a drug and is never addressed as Renya Karasuma. The theory is a plausible candidate, not a disclosed identity.
The Boss’s Name and Present Appearance Are Separate Questions
The identity behind the Black Organization’s title of boss is no longer the central question. Yusaku Kudo’s deduction identifies Renya Karasuma as the person behind the title.
What remains unresolved is not the boss’s name, but Karasuma’s current condition.
- Where is Karasuma now?
- What does Karasuma currently look like?
- In what condition is Karasuma alive?
- How are orders delivered to members of the organization?
The baby theory attempts to fill the gap concerning Karasuma’s appearance. The contrast between a known name and an unseen person is what makes an otherwise ordinary stroller feel ominous.
Where the Baby and Elderly Woman Appear: Volume 106 and Episodes 1264-1265 (Japanese Episodes 1204-1205)
The unidentified baby and the elderly woman appear in Volume 106, Files 1126 and 1128. The adapted case is Episodes 1264-1265 (Japanese episodes 1204-1205), titled Who Kidnapped Conan and Azusa? (Part 1) and Who Kidnapped Conan and Azusa? (Part 2).
The woman has a concrete role as a witness. The baby, by contrast, is shown twice with the face hidden but contributes no direct clue to the solution.
First Appearance in Volume 106, File 1126 and Episode 1264 (Japanese Episode 1204)
The pair first appears in Volume 106, File 1126. Its anime adaptation is Episode 1264 (Japanese episode 1204), Who Kidnapped Conan and Azusa? (Part 1).
Conan and Azusa Enomoto are forced into a black car. The elderly witness reports that somebody inside was sneezing, and her own cat allergy helps connect the sneeze with cat hair.
The woman’s cat allergy therefore serves a real purpose in the kidnapping case. The baby supplies no comparable clue and remains unidentified.
The contrast is striking: a useful witness stands inside an everyday mystery, while the concealed baby beside her evokes the series’ longer Black Organization plot. That contrast makes the scene suspicious without proving an organization connection.
Second Appearance in Volume 106, File 1128 and Episode 1265 (Japanese Episode 1205)
The woman and baby appear again in Volume 106, File 1128. The anime adaptation is Episode 1265 (Japanese episode 1205), Who Kidnapped Conan and Azusa? (Part 2).
They return near the end after the case has moved toward its resolution. The baby’s face and identity remain hidden in this second appearance.
A single appearance could have been explained as a natural detail accompanying the witness. Showing the pair again makes their presence feel more deliberate.
That repeated framing creates an unresolved aftertaste, but repetition alone cannot identify the baby as Karasuma.
Two Appearances, but Different Roles in the Case
The woman and baby enter together, but they do not perform the same narrative function. The woman sees the black car and provides testimony about the sneeze.
The baby gives no testimony and is not directly connected to the culprit or trick. Nevertheless, the baby is shown twice while the face remains concealed.
This difference allows the reading that the woman belongs to the immediate case while the baby may belong to a future story thread. For now, that remains an interpretation of the staging rather than confirmed plot information.
File 1141 Connects a Cat’s Cry with a Baby’s Cry
Volume 107, File 1141, Richard’s Tryst, includes a cat whose cry is mistaken for a baby’s. This scene does not reveal the identity of the baby from Volume 106.
What changes is how readers can interpret the sound recorded in Suguru Itakura’s old diary. A detail once accepted as a cat may deserve reconsideration.
A Cat at Eri Kisaki’s Office Sounds Like a Baby
At Eri Kisaki’s office, a sound like a baby crying comes from another room. The sound actually comes from a female cat brought by a client.
It sounds like a baby crying. The visitor explains that the sound is coming from a female cat. (unofficial translation)
The scene establishes that people can mistake a cat’s cry for a human baby’s cry. It does not establish that every earlier cat sound was a baby.
The placement is notable because it creates a reason to question an old Black Organization clue. A mundane animal sound becomes a possible bridge to a mystery left open for many volumes.
Conan Recalls Suguru Itakura and Ai Haibara’s Words
After hearing the comparison, Conan recalls earlier scenes connected to the Black Organization. Tequila, the haughty woman, Suguru Itakura, and Ai Haibara all appear in his memories.
Itakura’s diary says that the sound of a cat grew louder behind the woman on the telephone and that she ended the call in apparent haste. (unofficial translation) Itakura understood the sound as a cat.
After File 1141, it becomes possible that he instead heard a baby. Conan also recalls Haibara warning that people cannot resist the flow of time without consequences. (unofficial translation)
Haibara’s warning does not name Karasuma. Its relevance is thematic: it may relate to de-aging, the pursuit of unnatural longevity, or the organization’s research, but the exact connection remains unstated.
The Voice Clue Grew Stronger, Not the Baby’s Identification
File 1141 strengthens the possibility that the sound Itakura heard was not a cat. Reaching the conclusion that the hidden baby is Karasuma still requires several separate steps.
- Was the sound in Itakura’s diary actually a baby’s cry?
- If so, was that baby the same one shown in Volume 106?
- If so, was that baby Renya Karasuma?
The first question is now deliberately foregrounded, while the second and third lack direct evidence. The unidentified baby does not physically reappear in File 1141.
The sound clue may be forming a line, but that line stops before the identity question. Keeping those steps separate prevents an intriguing possibility from becoming a false confirmation.
Evidence Supporting the Theory That the Baby Is Renya Karasuma
The strongest support for the theory is the apparent link between Suguru Itakura’s diary and File 1141. Karasuma’s unknown appearance and the deliberate concealment of the baby’s face add circumstantial support.
None of these clues independently proves the baby’s identity.
The Cat’s Cry Recorded in Suguru Itakura’s Diary
Suguru Itakura was a computer graphics developer whom the Black Organization pressured to create software. His diary describes a call from a haughty woman and a catlike sound growing louder behind her before she abruptly ended the call.
At the time, taking the diary literally was reasonable. Once the story demonstrates that a cat and a baby can sound alike, a baby may have been near the caller.
The woman might have ended the call to prevent Itakura from learning about the baby. If the caller was Vermouth and the baby was Karasuma, the clues would form a coherent picture.
Yet neither the source of the sound nor the caller’s identity is fully established in the evidence discussed here. The diary has become a major clue, but its final identifications remain hidden.
Mistaking Cat and Baby Cries Revives an Old Clue
File 1141 deliberately demonstrates how a cat’s voice can be mistaken for a baby’s. Conan then recalls Itakura and Haibara, which makes the scene feel connected to the Black Organization plot rather than like an isolated fact.
The scene invites readers to question the old description of the sound. Reviving such an old clue deep into the series gives the moment unusual weight.
What has resurfaced is uncertainty about the sound’s source, not proof that the voice belonged to Karasuma. That boundary is essential to the theory.
Renya Karasuma’s Present Appearance and Location Remain Unknown
Renya Karasuma is described as a wealthy man who was believed to have died more than half a century ago. Although his name is now linked to the Black Organization’s boss, his current appearance and whereabouts remain undisclosed.
If he survived while aging normally, he would be extremely old. That gap permits theories involving rejuvenation, de-aging, another person’s name, or an unknown method of preserving the body.
The baby theory is one attempt to fill this large blank. A faceless baby fits the mystery visually, but that fit does not make the theory uniquely correct.
Weaknesses and Unresolved Questions in the Renya Karasuma Baby Theory
The theory draws on several suggestive details. However, APTX 4869’s long-term effects, Karasuma’s use of any drug, the sound Itakura heard, and the elderly woman’s identity are all unresolved.
The missing evidence matters as much as the clues that support the theory.
APTX 4869 Has Not Been Confirmed to Stop Growth
Conan has questioned why his height has not changed despite repeated measurements. He wonders whether the drug could be responsible. (unofficial translation)
This observation does not confirm that everyone de-aged by APTX 4869 stops growing forever. The small change could reflect the limited time elapsed, a drug effect, or another explanation.
Vermouth also presents a separate mystery because her appearance has not visibly aged over many years. Jodie asks why Vermouth does not age. (unofficial translation)
Conan’s apparent lack of growth and Vermouth’s ageless appearance both concern time, but the story has not established that they share a drug or mechanism. A de-aged Karasuma who cannot grow is possible, not confirmed.
There Is No Evidence That Haibara’s Other Drug Causes Aging
Haibara says she revived a drug using surviving research materials left by Atsushi Miyano and Elena Miyano. (unofficial translation) She also indicates that the drug she was truly compelled to make was something else.
Those remarks leave open distinctions among the Miyanos’ research, the drug Haibara reconstructed, and another drug demanded by the organization. They should not automatically be treated as one project.
Haibara’s warning about resisting time permits speculation about aging or rejuvenation. It remains unconfirmed whether the other drug was designed to age a baby into an adult, was made for Karasuma, or had a baby as its subject.
The Boss’s Use of Email Does Not Prove He Is a Baby
The Black Organization’s boss has communicated through an email address associated with the melody of the children’s song Nanatsu no Ko. Communication by text is compatible with the baby theory.
One could speculate that the boss avoids speaking because a baby cannot communicate normally. However, many other reasons could explain the use of email.
- To prevent identification by voice
- To conceal a location
- To avoid appearing even before organization members
- To preserve and distribute instructions
Email alone does not prove that the boss is a baby. The more secure conclusion is simply that the person at the top of the organization has remained physically elusive.
Black Iron Submarine and the All-Ages Recognition System Are Supporting Material Only
The movie Black Iron Submarine offers additional, movie-only material for thinking about Karasuma’s condition. Rum refers to determining the whereabouts of the boss, who has not appeared recently. (unofficial translation)
The line shows that Rum is concerned with the boss’s whereabouts. It does not prove that Rum has never met the boss or has no present means of contact.
The movie’s All-Ages Recognition System can match the same person across age changes. One theory is that the organization wanted it destroyed to protect a de-aged boss.
The system could also expose other de-aged people, including the connection between Haibara and Shiho Miyano, or reveal organization members’ past identities. Movie-only evidence can support the baby theory, but it does not directly establish the manga baby’s identity.
Is the Elderly Woman with the Stroller Vermouth?
The identity of the elderly woman pushing the stroller has not been revealed either. Vermouth’s disguise skills and special relationship with Karasuma make the hypothesis possible.
No decisive scene identifies the woman as Vermouth, so this question must be evaluated separately from the baby’s identity.
Why Readers Suspect the Elderly Woman Is Vermouth
The strongest basis for the Vermouth theory is her exceptional ability to disguise herself. Presenting herself as an elderly woman would be consistent with that skill.
Vermouth also occupies a privileged position close to the Black Organization’s boss. If the baby were Karasuma, casting Vermouth as the disguised protector would form a coherent arrangement.
If Vermouth were also the haughty woman who called Itakura, she might have been caring for whatever was making the catlike sound for some time. Each link in that chain, however, depends on another unconfirmed identification.
Without a revealed disguise or a confirming reaction from Vermouth, the elderly woman cannot currently be identified as her.
A Cat Allergy Alone Cannot Identify Vermouth
The elderly woman states that she is allergic to cats. This information helps explain the sneeze in File 1126, so it already has a function within the kidnapping case.
The evidence discussed here does not establish that Vermouth has a cat allergy. A future match would strengthen the disguise theory but would still not prove it on its own.
Even identifying the woman as Vermouth would not automatically identify the baby as Karasuma. The caretaker’s identity and the passenger’s identity are distinct claims.
She Could Be an Ordinary Woman or Another Associate
The possibility that the woman is simply a civilian remains open. Her role as a witness is natural, and she could merely be accompanying a grandchild or another relative.
She could also be another organization associate, the baby’s guardian, or a new character unrelated to Vermouth. An elderly woman pushing a stroller is not inherently suspicious.
The central visual mystery is not the age difference, but why the baby’s face is hidden in both appearances. That question remains meaningful even if the woman is not Vermouth.
If the woman is Vermouth, an ordinary street scene would suddenly belong to the Black Organization plot; if she is someone else, the scene may introduce a different long-term thread.
Conclusion
As of July 20, 2026, the identity of the concealed baby remains unknown in the evidence discussed here. It is too early to state that the baby is Renya Karasuma.
The presentation is nevertheless highly suggestive: the faceless baby appears twice in an ordinary kidnapping case, and a later chapter connects the sound of a cat with a baby’s cry before recalling Itakura and Haibara.
An old diary clue has resurfaced far beyond its original story, but the chain still contains three unproven links. Itakura may have heard a baby; that baby may be the one from Volume 106; and that baby may be Karasuma.
Those possibilities nearly form a single line, yet there is no direct evidence connecting all three. The same caution applies to the elderly woman: Vermouth is a plausible candidate, not a confirmed identity.
If the theory proves correct, the de-aging once treated as Conan’s private crisis would connect directly to the organization’s research and its boss. The series’ greatest enemy could have been hidden inside an everyday stroller, but for now that remains a compelling possibility rather than the answer.
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